RLP 199: Identifying John Wilson Part 2 – Documentary Evidence

Nicole (1s):
This is Research Like a Pro episode 199, Identifying John Wilson Part 2 – Documentary Evidence. Welcome to Research Like a Pro a Genealogy Podcast about taking your research to the next level, hosted by Nicole Dyer and Diana Elder accredited genealogy professional. Diana and Nicole are the mother-daughter team at FamilyLocket.com and the authors of Research Like a Pro A Genealogist Guide. With Robin Wirthlin they also co-authored the companion volume, Research Like a Pro with DNA. Join Diana and Nicole as they discuss how to stay organized, make progress in their research and solve difficult cases.

Nicole (42s):
Let’s go. Welcome everyone to research like a pro. We’re glad to be here together with Rick again, to talk about the Wilson research project. Hi Rick.

Rick Wilson (53s):
Hi, Nicole and Diana.

Diana (55s):
Hi. So glad to have you back.

Nicole (57s):
So how have you been doing, what are you working on?

Diana (59s):
I have been working on our DNA study group project and I’m doing the Leeds Method on the DNA test takers results that I’m using. And I’ve never done that before. She’s my second cousin. And so I decided I need to get more familiar with her matches. And it’s very interesting because the Leeds Method show that most of her top matches are on our line. She has very few, which is her maternal, and she has very few paternal matches. So the people on her father’s side just did not test, or there were not many descendants, but as you know, on the maternal side, there were 10 children. And so just tons more matches.

Diana (1m 39s):
Anyway, it’s been very illuminating because I didn’t know much about her actual DNA matches.

Nicole (1m 45s):
Yeah. The same thing that I found with your results, I was doing Leeds Method on your 23andme matches, and there’s just, aren’t very many matches on your side from England. The Kelsey Bettos line. We Have a lot on your paternal side because they’re all from the colonial US and there’s a lot of descendants in America who’ve tested their DNA with 23andMe, but not as many from England. It’s interesting to see how those trends and family sizes influence the number of matches.

Diana (2m 18s):
And cultural prohibitions against testing. You know, a lot of people just don’t test in Europe or England or Germany.

Nicole (2m 27s):
Yeah. Which is why I really like Living DNA because I feel like, you know, the are a British company and they focus on British ancestry, I think that brings in more test takers over there.

Diana (2m 36s):
And more people that actually have that read more recent ancestry in England, like we do. And it’s been fun using my mom’s DNA at Living DNA because she’s got three of her lines directly from England and they are grandparent lines. I mean, they’re close lines. And so we get really specific regions that she is from. So fun to look at it

Nicole (3m 0s):
Well, let’s jump into talking about the Wilson’s. So Rick, can you give us a recap of our last episode with you last week about identifying John Wilson’s origins?

Rick Wilson (3m 11s):
Yeah, so we were talking about my ancestor, John Wilson, who was born about 176, and died in 1799 in Franconia township, Montgomery county, Pennsylvania. And what we last talked about was using Y-DNA and autosomal DNA to kind of help point me in the direction of, you know, where in Europe, John Wilson’s ancestors likely came from. Y-DNA really pointed me towards County Fermanagh in Northern Ireland and autosomal DNA identified several clusters of DNA matches that had, that appeared to be tied to my Wilson line and also had County Fermanagh origins.

Rick Wilson (4m 5s):
And so using that is where I’m going to be taking the research into the documentary space.

Diana (4m 12s):
So whenever you say Irish research, anyone who’s ever worked in that area just kind of groans because it is not easy. So just tell us some of the challenges that you face because we’re talking Irish research in the 1700s, but is even more difficult.

Rick Wilson (4m 28s):
Yes, it was, it was very daunting. And, and to be honest, for many years, I put off doing some of this research just because I felt, you know, overwhelmed by it and lack of familiarity. But what I started to do was really what is step three of the Research Like a Pro process, which is locality research. And I really dug in my heels and started looking at like what records exist. And for me, because I was dealing with Northern Ireland, there is an Ulster historical foundation that really provided a great foundation for the different types of records that are available there.

Rick Wilson (5m 9s):
And you’re right, Diana, the 1700s, it’s sparse to begin with. So that was a very big challenge for me. And one of the items that is problematic for a lot of Irish records is that during the civil war, which I believe was around 1922, a lot of the records were destroyed and or burned as part of the civil war, which erased a lot of valuable information for anybody doing Irish research.

Diana (5m 42s):
Yeah. 1922, that’s the horror year for everybody because you just wonder what was destroyed. So what did you end up having available?

Rick Wilson (5m 51s):
There’s a number of resources that are actually out there. Some of them were transcriptions that were done prior to the civil war so some of that information exists for some records and for some counties in Ireland. So that was there and there’s some other documents that survived, but the majority of these documents either provide no names associated with just counts of whether they were British subjects versus Irish subjects, or like many censuses we have here in the US before 1850 only provided the head of household. And so those were the records that I tended to focus on.

Rick Wilson (6m 33s):
And some of those records were like the muster rolls, which were to say, who was capable of bearing arms and support of the king there. And that was in the 1600s. And there were some religious censuses that occurred in the mid 1700s. Then there’s some other tax records that were also very valuable. There’s the Tithe Applotment records in the early 1800s and the Griffith valuation records, which were also tax records. And those were in the mid 1800s.

Diana (7m 5s):
I’ve used a few of those, but some of those are, are unique. I have never used muster rolls or the freeholders records and interesting about the Church of Ireland records. So Church of Ireland was similar to Church of England in that it was the Protestant answer to the Catholic church. Is that correct?

Rick Wilson (7m 24s):
That is correct. You know, that record group was what, the one that I started off with and it provides some really good information. It provides what religion everybody was and, and by head of household and listed by town, this was done so that, you know, the Church of Ireland could know who was of which faith and could assert its dominance by knowing this information. And so that’s what this information represented and it represented the timeframe of 1766.

Nicole (7m 56s):
Now tell us more about how this religious census helped you use kind of the information you had found from the clusters and the FAN club members and kind of pulled things together a little bit.

Rick Wilson (8m 9s):
Absolutely. So one of the things that to kind of step back and remind listeners, if they’ve listened to the first podcast, I had identified two groups of clusters and both with County Fermanagh connections, they matched each other, but they were from different time periods in the US in terms of their immigration. So my ancestor was born in 17, early 1700s. There was that group, there’s the group that arrived in the Pennsylvania part of the Pennsylvania cluster that was in the late 1700s. And then there was the New Haven cluster, which was in the mid 1800s. So I knew I wanted to start off with the earliest record group that would help me bridge my ancestors, likely origins and potentially the early 1700s with that Pennsylvania cluster is the next oldest route, which was they left Ireland after the revolutionary war in the US is when they arrived.

Rick Wilson (9m 5s):
And the 1766 was kind of that sweet spot in between that era. And it also is the most comprehensive record group of data during that time period. And so what I did was I knew from my Pennsylvania cluster and my New Haven cluster, I had identified a few key surnames that were associated with those clusters beyond the Wilson surname. And that was Burgess and Cosgrove, which are more English or Scottish names and Bannon and Fari, which were more Irish surnames. And so I use those as kind of like the FAN club, you know, friends, associates and neighbors.

Rick Wilson (9m 50s):
And what I did was because Wilson is such a common name, and even back in 1766, it was a really common name, and I had to use the FAN network to try to pinpoint where to focus my Wilson research. So what I did is I looked in county Fermanagh for those instances of the surnames Burgess, Bannon, Cosgrove and Fari. And I found out that those names seem to be located in an area east of what is the capital of Fermanagh, which is Enniskillen. And they were in these two towns, one called Derrygonnelly and the other one, Cavanacarragh.

Rick Wilson (10m 31s):
And these two towns are only about two and a half miles from each other, but that’s where all of these surnames of interest were located. And then what I did was then say, okay, if this is probably the area that I needed to focus on what Wilsons are located there, it was there that I found one group of Wilson, larger group and Derrygonnelly, and one Wilson named Robert Wilson in the town of Cavanacarragh. And so that’s how I use the religious census to kind of pinpoint an area within county Fermanagh to really begin a lot of my documentary evidential research.

Nicole (11m 11s):
That is amazing. You know, the names that you pulled out of the autosomal DNA clusters then helped you locate where within the county to look for your Wilsons, that’s just the perfect FAN club strategy.

Rick Wilson (11m 23s):
Thank you. I mean, it helps when you have names that aren’t common matched with a name that is too common,

Diana (11m 32s):
And I loved the map that you created, your visual is amazing.

Nicole (11m 36s):
Was that in PowerPoint too?

Rick Wilson (11m 37s):
So I, I did that in PowerPoint. I’m a marketing professor, so I create my own lectures and PowerPoint. So I’m very well versed in it. And all that I did was I found a map in county Fermanagh showing me all the different town lands is what they call the towns. And I put it in PowerPoint. And then I used a tracing tool in PowerPoint to give me the outlines that I needed, and then I could customize it however I see fit to do so, which is what I’ve done in that visual that you’re referencing.

Diana (12m 12s):
Well, it’s an amazing map. I need to learn that skill. That is amazing. I love that. And I’m just so flabbergasted at your amazing visual I forgot what I was going to say, but I am going to agree that using those unusual surnames was just brilliant. So good. Oh, I know. I wanted to talk about a little bit about the jurisdictions. So when you were diving into this Irish research, I’m sure you had to familiarize yourself with these different terms, perish and townland, and Ireland is a little crazy with jurisdictions.

Rick Wilson (12m 48s):
They very much are. You know, when I referenced county Fermanagh, it’s more as if it was a state, you know, like Pennsylvania or Ohio. And then when you kind of take it down to the next level, it would be a Barony, which I would kind of equate it to more of what we think of counties here in the US then you go down into the town lands, which would be more of like either a township or a town. And then when you think of parishes, that’s more associated with the religious side rather than the civil side. And so it’s very, very difficult to kind of sort out the overlapping boundaries and, you know, because a parish is going to be different than a civil record group.

Rick Wilson (13m 34s):
And it was just very challenging. And I think what helped me the most was finding a link to several sources that gave me an outline for, you know, where these town lines were and for how to actually find them in a map, because many of these, you can’t just Google and say, where is this town land? They don’t really exist at that level in Google.

Diana (13m 56s):
And this is a good plug for doing a locality guide, right. And having someplace to hold all that information as you’re gathering it,

Rick Wilson (14m 4s):
It certainly is. And that was valuable to me.

Diana (14m 7s):
Good. Good. Well, let’s talk about the next record group. The Tithe Applotment records. Tell us more about those. Yeah,

Rick Wilson (14m 15s):
So this record group was very helpful because it was, again, another more complete set of records. It is a tax record that was used by the Irish government to kind of maintain dominance for the church. So it was a tax on individuals, and it was fairly comprehensive again, only providing the head of household, but by townland. And it was a way for me to kind of fill in the gap between when the Pennsylvania group left Ireland for America and the new Haven cluster when they left. So it was kind of a point in between, and it was another comprehensive record group.

Rick Wilson (14m 55s):
And so what I did similar to the religious survey is I looked at the FAN club, plotted those and concentrated on the, that area east of Enniskillen and the towns of Derrygonnelly and Cavanacarragh. And again, plotted them and potted them with the Wilsons and was able to see a very definitive pattern again, that you could see how the Wilsons were pushing out of the town lands of Derrygonnelly and moving into the surrounding town lands and the same way for the Wilsons and Cavanacarragh doing that. And then you also saw that with the others allied surnames of Fari and Bannon, not so much with Burgess, but with those other ones, certainly.

Diana (15m 43s):
So you think that they were just, as the families were growing, they needed to move out to get more land or, or what did you hypothesize with that?

Rick Wilson (15m 54s):
So I, I did hypothesize exactly that, that they were kind of pushing out in search of, of new land to cultivate or to, to mill. And you could see that within the pattern of the way that they were kind of progressing out and, and not to jump ahead to some of the historical context, but as I was reading about the era, that’s exactly what a lot of them were doing as populations grew, they need more land to support their families. And so I saw that there, and that was also some of the pretext for why some people migrated elsewhere outside of Northern Ireland as well.

Diana (16m 31s):
That makes sense.

Nicole (16m 32s):
Okay. Let’s go talk now about Griffith’s valuation. So what were you able to glean about the Wilson’s from that record set?

Rick Wilson (16m 41s):
The Griffith’s valuations were a tax on agricultural land and built property. And this one was administered between 1848 and 1864 in my particular area. But I was concentrating on was a little bit later in the, if I remember correctly in the run the 18 later fifties or early 1860s, and this wasn’t so much as helpful for the Wilsons as it was for one of the FAN clubs. That was part of the clusters that I identified in both Pennsylvania and the New Haven cluster. It allowed me along with the Applotment records to ensure that I was focusing in on the right area.

Rick Wilson (17m 23s):
And I was finding the Fari group, which is a surname associated with my Pennsylvania cluster and that Bannon group, which was associated with the New Haven cluster. I was able to find them in these records. And that was confirmation to say, okay, I’m in the right area. And so my Wilsons are also likely from this area, if I’m finding exact references to these other families in this area,

Nicole (17m 52s):
That’s a kind of a good research check to follow things forward in time, make sure things are still fitting together in the right way and do a little extra work to, to verify what you’ve been finding.

Rick Wilson (18m 5s):
Absolutely. And you know, what was also interesting for anybody who’s not worked with a Griffith’s valuation records, they actually do provide most places anyway, provided detailed map of these locations in so much that they will actually show where the houses are built and placed in those town lands. And you can see where families lived really adjacent to each other. I mean, like I’m talking like feet from one another and that kind of confirms, you know, family relationships amongst other items of interest.

Diana (18m 38s):
Yeah. I’ve used Griffith’s a few times and it is a pretty interesting record set and it’s widely available now. Great resource. Well, you alluded to some historical context that really helped let’s talk about that.

Rick Wilson (18m 59s):
Absolutely. So kind of summarizing what I had found in the previous documentary and DNA was it pointed me to, you know, two particular town lands, one Derrygonnelly and the other Cavanacarragh. I wanted to understand the historical records, migrations, people, culture, of those two town lands. What I did was I looked to what is probably maybe more non-traditional types of historical context. I know a lot of us will read different books and, you know, county histories and Northern Ireland has county histories as well. There were several on county Fermanagh.

Rick Wilson (19m 39s):
So I read that, but I also sought out academic journals. And maybe because I’m a marketing professor, I’m more inclined to consider that, that record group, but these were academically written articles from a historical context, talking about history in particular location, some of them as specific to regions within county Fermanagh and others more broadly, but it really provided me the understanding to know what was going on during this time period, how likely were people to move beyond their small townland and why would they even leave Northern Ireland? What I was able to learn some really key pieces of information, a lot of the English and Scottish moved into county Fermanagh during the Ulster plantation, which was about 1610, but around 1622, most migration into Northern Ireland really stopped.

Rick Wilson (20m 36s):
I mean, there were certainly some, but it was the majority of happened in that first dozen or so years. And after that population grew organically either through additional generations or within migration. And that really kind of helped me understand when did my Wilson’s likely come and enter these two townland areas. And it also allowed me to understand did the English or Scottish intermarry with the local Irish. And I found out that it was extremely rare, but the interesting thing was is that Bannon’s and Fari is Irish, Wilson and Burgess are English or Scottish.

Rick Wilson (21m 18s):
And there was some intermarriage that happened there as evidenced in my DNA. And I found some other evidence to kind of suggesting a Wilson and Bannon marriage, you know, from the 1700s. So it really provided me that context, understand how did my ancestor get from county Fermanagh to Pennsylvania?

Diana (21m 40s):
I’m really glad you mentioned the scholarly journals because I agree sometimes those give you just what you need. You know, we can access those on jstor J S T O R that website now. And it’s amazing what you can find out there. You know, people who have just done their thesis on something specific in history, and it may just give you the clue you need in your research. So I agree, we, we love county histories, but broadening our search can really help with that historical context.

Nicole (22m 15s):
So were there any more sources from the 1700s that you consulted at this point?

Rick Wilson (22m 20s):
There was one other record group that was very helpful for me. And they’re called the freeholders records. They represent a very early period of time in Northern Ireland history. You know, really about the mid, maybe a little bit earlier in the 1700s. And this record group is for individuals who had owned land in Northern Ireland or had a lifelong lease to those lands. So it’s not quite a census or something fully encompassing, but what it showed me was where some of my Wilsons were, and I saw some of the same patterns, you know, they were in Derrygonnelly or the town lands right around it.

Rick Wilson (23m 3s):
And then what I saw interesting within this record is that there was no Wilsons and Cavanacarragh where a lot of the other FAN group was from. That Wilson didn’t arrive until 1766. But what I found was there was another Robert Wilson that was somewhere else close by in those freeholders records. But then when I get to the 1766 religious census record, that Robert Wilson has in Cavanacarragh, but he’s not in the freeholders record in that previous location, which suggested to me that I could kind of see some of those migration patterns to the extent that that freeholder’s records was encompassing of that area.

Nicole (23m 45s):
That’s nice to see the migration there.

Rick Wilson (23m 48s):
Yes. Finding those record groups that provide the most encompassing periods of time that are more like a census that we’re used to over here in the US and then filling in those gaps with other record groups that maybe aren’t as encompassing as a census, but still provides you meaningful data points in which to kind of connect those dots.

Nicole (24m 7s):
Yeah. You’re really connecting a lot of dots here that are challenging to put altogether. It’s a good example of using what we have and put in all the pieces of indirect evidence together to come to some ideas and conclusions about what was happening.

Rick Wilson (24m 25s):
Yeah.

Diana (24m 25s):
And that’s a good example of negative indirect evidence too, that your Robert was not found in the 1766 census. So it suggests that he had not yet migrated, you know, a lot of times people are, are wondering how do you use negative evidence? And this is a good example. And you don’t just figure that out at first, that’s from correlating, everything else that you can start to use. Something like that.

Rick Wilson (24m 49s):
Yes. I think correlation is very, very important.

Diana (24m 52s):
So which is why we write the reports. Right. So what theories do you have based on the documentary and DNA evidence?

Rick Wilson (25m 2s):
I have two. One is that my Wilsons were in this area well before the 1740s and 50s, which is kind of like the earliest record group of information pointing my Wilsons to this location and that there just happens to be no other records that will corroborate, you know, that they were there as early as the early 1700s. And so that’s one theory that, you know, they were there at that point. And it’s key to kind of remember that my ancestor was born likely around 1716. So that’s kind of like the era I’m looking for. And my competing theory is that they likely moved into the area around 1750 from some other place within county Fermanagh or maybe neighboring counties.

Rick Wilson (25m 50s):
But I tend to migrate my own beliefs towards my first theory, because I did find some references that point back to a time like right around 1700 to 1720, that I found two writings mentioning that Wilsons lived in and around Derrygonnelly at that time. And they specifically said they owned and operated a mill dating back to 1720 in one instance. And the other one said that at the time that the somebody else, the major estate owner was doing repairs, that the Wilsons were operating a farm there at that time.

Rick Wilson (26m 31s):
So it kind of suggests that my first theory is probably the likely one.

Diana (26m 35s):
I love that you have some hypotheses that we are working to either prove or disprove well, that’s great that you found that mention of the Wilsons in that early time. What was the record? That was another publication.

Rick Wilson (26m 49s):
Yeah, so it was two different publications. One was a documented history of county Fermanagh, and it was literally a footnote that said this Wilson operated a mill in this section outside of Derrygonnelly, which was interesting because they operated a mill. My ancestor, John Wilson lived near a mill in Bucks county, suggesting that maybe he was doing what was familiar to his family by working in a mill when he first arrived Pennsylvania. And the other one was a document where one of the estate owners who owned large chunks of land and county Fermanagh was reviewing all of his records in the family collection.

Rick Wilson (27m 33s):
And he happened to mention when he was talking about when there were major repairs to his estate, he mentioned that there was a farm owned by a Wilson who could trace their male line back to this time period. And that time period, if I remember correctly was like 1707 was when the repairs to his estate was being undertaken.

Diana (27m 58s):
That’s great. What a body of evidence you’ve collected with the DNA and the documentary work and the historical context. So fun to see it all come together.

Nicole (28m 7s):
It is. So let’s summarize what is the conclusion that you have come to and tying in, you know, Robert Wilson and, and how he might relate with John Wilson?

Rick Wilson (28m 17s):
I think the simple conclusion that I’ve come with is, is that John Wilson is a likely from county Fermanagh. He may have been born there. I don’t think I have enough evidence to suggest that he has or hasn’t actually, but my belief is that he has, just based off of migration patterns into Pennsylvania at that time. I believe then true because of the other evidence that I found is that the Wilson ancestors likely came from Scotland based off of that county history that I found from Linn county Iowa mentioned in the previous podcast. I also believe that Robert Wilson that I found living in Cavanacarragh is a critical individual to really understanding who John Wilson is.

Rick Wilson (29m 0s):
It’s inconclusive to know whether this Robert Wilson is of the same age as my John Wilson, or if he’s an older individual suggesting that maybe he’s the father. My belief is that this Robert Wilson that showed up in the 1766 religious census in Cavanacarragh is probably likely a brother or maybe even an uncle of John Wilson and that they probably share a common ancestor that comes from Derrygonnelly, which is where the majority of the Wilsons are known to have lived in during that time period. So that’s kind of the conclusion that I’ve, I’ve come up with at this point.

Nicole (29m 38s):
That’s wonderful. You know, I think you’ve come to a satisfying conclusion for this research objective. And you know, what’s interesting about your objective is that you didn’t say, I need to find the parents and John Wilson, you know, you wanted to find his origins, his Homeland, and something like that is one that we often can’t find an answer in a time when records are sparse. And a lot of evidence for relationships is lacking. So it’s neat that you were able to find an answer to your question. Now, the big question I have tasked you is when are you going there?

Rick Wilson (30m 16s):
You don’t want to, I’ve been plotting it. So I’m actually thinking in 2023, a lot of my family members are interested in going and putting their eyes and feet on the same grounds. And so that’s when I’m planning on going there and hitting those local depositories for records there. And so 2023 is the target year.

Nicole (30m 36s):
It’s really soon. Congratulations. I hope it works out. That will be fun.

Diana (30m 40s):
Well, and so how great that you actually have a location, you know, you’re not just showing up in Ireland and going, okay, where are you? Because I honestly have heard others say, I just need to go to Ireland. And I’m like, yeah, you do need to go Ireland, but you’ve got to figure it out first where you’re going to go. You’ve got such a good hypothesis of what happened there. And I am just looking at your report. We’ll put a link to this in the show notes, but you can go on Rick’s website and read his entire research report, which has 41 pages. And it has great visuals, completely sourced, cited to go takes you through the DNA, as well as all the documentary work.

Diana (31m 19s):
And I love that you end up with future research suggestions, cause you’re not done. You have some ideas

Nicole (31m 26s):
I don’t think we’re ever done are we?

Diana (31m 28s):
We’re not, but I think it’s just helpful to know that there is more you can do rather than just saying, okay, well, that’s as good as it gets. I don’t know what else I can do with this. I love that you’ve got six solid suggestions of what to do next.

Rick Wilson (31m 42s):
Thank you so much. I’ve really enjoyed sharing my research with you and your listeners. And I really hope it inspires others to tackle that. Especially if it’s Irish research, because we know how much of a challenge that can be. Sometimes it’s just digging in and getting your feet wet.

Nicole (31m 58s):
Absolutely. I know we have been inspired, so I’m sure our listeners are as well.

Diana (32m 2s):
I know we’ve got some Scotch Irish immigrants that we have not even began to trace back. We’ve got to get them out of the United States. So we’ve got to even get them past 1800, some of them, but we’ve got so much work to do. We’ll get there.

Nicole (32m 14s):
You know, I think in the next step might be Y-DNA analysis, because I think that was a really key part of, I mean, how else could you have gotten the clue of where to go?

Rick Wilson (32m 24s):
That was the linchpin.

Diana (32m 25s):
Yeah, I think a good takeaway here is to track down a Y-DNA test taker for all of those lines in question, just get it out there and probably to eventually get to the 700 level, the Y-DNA 700 level, because you get more information. Would you agree?

Rick Wilson (32m 43s):
You definitely I’ve written a recent blog post about targeted wide DNA testing. And I think the key is, is not to jump into the big 700 1st cause it’s obviously quite expensive. Start out with the lowest level, make sure you have that match and then increase it from there

Diana (32m 59s):
Because you don’t have to re test you just pay more and then you get to the next level.

Rick Wilson (33m 6s):
Absolutely.

Diana (33m 6s):
That’s a really good strategy to start with. I think that’s $119 right now for the 37 marker. Start there and then see if you want to continue. Well, thank you so much for writing the blog post series for us. Well, first of all, for even just giving us a shot with the study group, that’s a big commitment. So we’re so glad that we got to know you through that and that you came on the podcast and told us all about your research. It’s been such a pleasure.

Rick Wilson (33m 33s):
Thank you. It’s been a great experience from the Research Like a Pro class, as, as well as just writing the guest blog. It’s been, it’s been my pleasure.

Nicole (33m 41s):
All right, well, I put a link to Rick’s website in our show notes. So make sure you go check out his new series about targeted Y-DNA testing and read his reports and we hope you all have a great week and we’ll talk to you again next week.

Diana (33m 56s):
All right. Bye bye everyone.

Nicole (33m 57s):
Bye. Thank you for listening. We hope that something you heard today will help you make progress in your research. If you want to learn more, purchase our books, Research Like a Pro and Research Like a Pro with DNA on Amazon.com and other booksellers. You can also register for our online courses or study groups of the same names. Learn more at FamilyLocket.com/services. To share your progress and ask questions, join our private Facebook group by sending us your book receipt or joining our courses to get updates in your email inbox each Monday, subscribe to our newsletter at FamilyLocket.com/newsletter. Please subscribe, rate and review our podcast. We read each review and are so thankful for them. We hope you’ll start now to Research Like a Pro.